Thanks for your help everybody.

It's kind of funny for years Railroad Supply Company used to be based in Burbank barely even 2-3 miles away from Disney Studios. They used to have a shop on Victory Blvd.

Sorry, I haven't checked the board for awhile.

I beleive the stroke is 3 inches on both.

The funny thing is, the cylinder bore of the Lilly Belle is 2 1/8, the same saize of the RRSC cylinder WITHOUT the liner. I talked to some guys on the Home Machinest web site a few years ago about this. Several felt RRSC may have sleeved down the cylinders to use less steam. As for the pulling power, we (Carolwood Society and Disney Barn) have for along time wanted to find a running Lilly Belle to compare to a RRSC model. Yes, I have seen the video we show in the barn with Walt pulling a long train. But I have never seen a RRSC 173 pull much more than 3 adults up the Los Angeles Live Steamers steepest grade. So I don't know how Walt did it. He did have working sanders which help and because he ran on the same track all the time, probably knew when to pour on the power to make the hill. Also, RRSC used alum. in many parts that are brass on the Disney engine. That adds up to more weight which means more pulling power. I am waiting to hear from someone in the mid-west who is supposed to have a Disney engine that runs. Hopefully he can solve the mystery.
Bill B
Disney Barn Crew Chief

Oh wow, thanks a lot. I've seen how well sanders work, a father/son team have an Allen American at my club and they've managed to pull somewhere between 10 and 15 cars with a few passengers with no problems at all. Evidence from the last run day-
[img]http://www.steamonly.org/pics/09/rd022209_37.jpg[/img]

The Allen American is bigger and heavier than the CP 173 types. 8 inch drivers and larger cylinders and boiler. Looks like a great running engine.
If you get out to the Disney Barn on the 3rd Sunday of the month, we have two RRSC Americans on display and a chassis made from Disney parts.
Bill

That's been a goal of mine since I found out it was there, but never got around to it. I can tell that the 173 is smaller than the Allen engines, but how much smaller is the boiler? That was another complaint I had heard about the engine, most everybody I talked to recommended Allen over other engines of that size but I like how the 173 looks, which I guess isn't a very good reason compared to practicality when you consider how much of an investment live steam is.

The 173 has a true wagon top boiler. I think the mail barrel is something like 6 inches in diameter. I think the Allen is 8. Also, the Allen is steel and the 173's usually have copper because of shape. One guy in Alaska who has a RRSC 173 suggested if you built one, make a steel boiler and make it as heave as you can for added traction. Also, everyone I know has added lead weight to anyplace they could hide it.
The Allen engine is a free lance design, where as the 173 is scaled from the prototype. Kind of depends what you want to do. Pull a large load, or have the prettiest engine in the club.
E-mail me off line about the barn visit,,, billb@carolwood.org
Thanks
Bill

Thanks a lot, I really appreciate it.

This is my first time posting so if I mess this up I apologize in advance. I am currently building a RRS CP173 and have noticed a number of differences between the Disney plans and the RRS. I have a copy of the 1952 Disney plans and compare them to the RRS as I build the sections. I am currently working on the tender, the trucks are very similar, I did not notice any variations between the plans, but I did not worry too much about it as I am using archbar trucks. I am modeling after the C. K. Holliday. The Disney frame calls for cast aluminum and has the end sills cast in. The RRS is built from angel and channel iron.

I bought my plans used and they came with two sets of tender tank plans, one from 1971 which almost duplicated the Disney plans, and one from 1980 that called for a cast fiberglass tank. The 1971 RRS plans looked like they were almost a direct copy of the Disney plans, almost no variation but a few more hidden angle brass supports hidden inside the tank. The fiberglass plans are very different, no water tank hatch or cover just a square hole where you fit your seat cushion in, on the legs of the tank the outer front edge is a 90 degree arch with the opposite edge squared off where the Disney plans call for a 180 leg end. I am currently building the Disney version of the tender tank out of half hard brass sheet and rivets.

I find the RRS plans are much more detailed with more call outs. The Disney plans seemed geared more to the true machinist who is used to reading blueprints. The smoke box and stack are next. I think I am going with the Disney stack that again calls out for half hard brass and rivets versus the RRS spun brass. A lot more work but I think it will look more authentic. Off to Disneyland in the AM to take a few photos of the replica Lilly Belle stack at the Main Street Station.

Howdy,
I plan on building a RRSC 4-4-0 next year. Its going to be like the Lilly Belle/C.K. Holiday but with a different paint scheme. Any pointers on taking on a task this massive. I have some machining skills and some insight on the Disneyland Locos. I will try to join LA live steamers once I get back home (Im in Japan). Got some extra cash floating around and if all works out this year I could get this project rolling. Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks!